[Cecil]

I dont mind ES chips. Most wont OC as much as some retail anyway. And if they were banned, then you would just hear people complain about cherry chips. ES chips and retail chips are almost the same, they dont make one better then the other on purpose. Thats why they have to test through a bunch of them to find the cherries. Just cause its an ES means nothing.

My D0 is a fairly good chip. My E8500 is the best Ive seen. D0 got 4.8HT with water, and E8500 does 4.2Ghz with stock voltages. Neither are ES, but both are better then some ES chips.

The one thing I think should be in a different catagory is multi CPU systems. People going to work and running wprime on their companies $35k server is rediculous. If you dont buy it, or it does not belong to you, you should not be allowed to test it.

And for cooling, all they have to do is require realtemp be in the screen shot to determin if you are using air/water or extreme. Should seperate them by -+0C. Anything 0C or under is extreme, anything over goes in normal section.

[DrNip]

Wow 10 viewing this thread at once now. Hot topic!

[rickss69]

When Bill Gates adoption papers for me go through daddy will buy me anything I want. I'm gonna kick all yur arses...

[Kal-EL]

There are a ton of perspectives on all these issues and a ton more of opinions on them as well.
Lets try and look at it from all the angles before deciding if there is a right and wrong.
In the end, we're all overclocking enthusiasts, some with more resources than others, but we
all have a deep appreciation for the art of overclocking. Be it an ES chip, a free chip, a borrowed
chip, a rented chip or a handout chip, we all love overclocking it.

Lets be sure to have intelligent and respectful discussions on these highly controversial matters.

[Splave]

Originally Posted by Cecil

I dont mind ES chips. Most wont OC as much as some retail anyway. And if they were banned, then you would just hear people complain about cherry chips. ES chips and retail chips are almost the same, they dont make one better then the other on purpose. Thats why they have to test through a bunch of them to find the cherries. Just cause its an ES means nothing.

My D0 is a fairly good chip. My E8500 is the best Ive seen. D0 got 4.8HT with water, and E8500 does 4.2Ghz with stock voltages. Neither are ES, but both are better then some ES chips.

The one thing I think should be in a different catagory is multi CPU systems. People going to work and running wprime on their companies $35k server is rediculous. If you dont buy it, or it does not belong to you, you should not be allowed to test it.

And for cooling, all they have to do is require realtemp be in the screen shot to determin if you are using air/water or extreme. Should seperate them by -+0C. Anything 0C or under is extreme, anything over goes in normal section.

ES chips are not owned either though. IMO most ES chips given to the big guns are tested cherries. They then can post on forums how great they clock so everyone gets all excited to go hit the checkout button so they can do the same thing!

no way to validate what cooling is used, you could use phase then set the TJmax in realtemp to make it look like you are sitting at air temps

[69_Goat]

"First of all, these ES processors are meant for internal use by Intel engineers and their partners. They are not meant for sale at all. They are generally
used in Intel's quality control tests and remain Intel's property after the fact."

Quote taken from here, http://www.techarp.com/showarticle.a...tno=407&pgno=0

Is this statement true or false?

The way I see it, either the rules should change or hwbot should enforce them, neither of which, I foresee in the near future. The manufacturers wont change
what they do, there's too much money at stake. We, as participants, at hwbot have two choices. Either accept it or ignore it. Take your pick.

Personally, I don't care. I'm not in this for fame and glory. I'm here to aquire knowledge and skills, and for the personal satisfaction of learning and pushing myself and my hardware.

[Cecil]

Originally Posted by Splave

ES chips are not owned either though. IMO most ES chips given to the big guns are tested cherries. They then can post on forums how great they clock so everyone gets all excited to go hit the checkout button so they can do the same thing!

no way to validate what cooling is used, you could use phase then set the TJmax in realtemp to make it look like you are sitting at air temps

I agree with this, expecially for ram. Corsiar and OCZ sending out cherry sticks when the real ones are no where near as close.

I still think ES chips should be ok, just cause of the cherry retails out there. Just cause you have a cherry chip, doesnt mean it will work out best in the end. The rest of your system has to be up to par, and you have to know what you are doing to get it up there as well.

I see ES chips on ebay all the time, but chances are they are about the same as retail.

[3oh6]

Originally Posted by Splave

Why would you bytch when you are getting goodies for free?
You dont feel bad at all competing against people who have to buy their own stuff? I wouldnt want the rules to change either if I was in your position. And yes I am Def jealous.

free?

your definition of free and mine must be completely different. working my ass off, sacrificing everything from work to life to love, giving up on numerous other hobbies i enjoy, sleeping next to nothing for weeks/months on end, not eating properly at times because i can't afford food, not buying new clothes, shoes, entertainment...is not free in my definition of the word.

i'm sorry but suggesting that i receive anything free is a joke and truly outlines your lack of knowledge as to what goes into a computer hardware review. i don't fault you for it, but please try to understand what you are implying with statements like that. don't get me wrong, i am not complaining about all those sacrifices, if i was, i simply wouldn't continue to do it. and yes i enjoy doing what i do, and why i make the sacrifices i do, but i sure as hell don't get anything free...anything.

heck, i got the F1EE today from Vince, it was "free"...or was it? ask anyone who put in time and effort to compete in the 01 low clock challenge if they had won the competition if the prize would have been free? something tells me that is a unanimous NO vote.

[Kal-EL]

The bwnage memory sticks are rarely mentioned and there are some sweet performing non-retail sticks floating around, really impressive stuff.

Far as the guys who've shed blood, sweat, tears and meals to become recognized and recieve the perks that go along with it, I commend them. Theres only one way to get to the top around here and its to put in the time. Alot of these guys are beyond dedicated and at times I wish I had the amount of time needed to reach this precipice. Alas, I'm trin to hook people up with hardware to help them reach their goals.

SuperPI32m contest almost ready for launch

[3oh6]

Originally Posted by Chuchnit

Very respectful actions I stand corrected and will now eat crow

So is you keeping the samples something that comes with the territory, or do you have to purchase the product direct from the manufacturer? BTW, are you gonna be doing one of those killer OC reports on the new and improved dom gt's?

i believe that keeping the samples is the norm for the industry of small to mid range sites. there have been very few times over the course of my review career that i have been asked to return hardware. i have also only written for two sites so both would be considered small to mid-size, although i think HardwareCanucks is getting close to the bigger end of the mid-size spectrum.

i think it is understood reviewers do this on their own time for small sites and manufacturers understand the hardware is their compensation.

as for the new Dom GT's, as soon as i saw the thread here i fired out a PM to my director to see what we could do. i know Corsair was interested in sending one of TEC cooling units so hopefully i can get one of the new 2000 CL7's with it. now that i have a CPU that can clock memory to almost 1200MHz, i am not scared of those bad boy GT's anymore