Waza/CDT tweaks

[Chuchnit]

Well since some of you super pi champs like 3OH6 is here I figured I'd ask. I'm not asking for your secret sauce waza file size or anything. I would just like a clear explanation of exactly what it does and why it helps 32m? I've played a little with superpi tweaker but have no clue on where to start adjusting the proggie. For some of you hardcore guys, yes I know that it is posted places like the xs lc thread, but I honestly don't have enough free time to sift through 200+ pages in a thread. Plus I don't think I've seen anyone explain how/why it works.

lemme say once again.... I don't expect you to share your waza file size or how many times you do it. Just a little how to and why to do it. I already know to play with page file and maxmem tweak.

Thanks Chuchnit :)

[Chuchnit]

Ok so no one wants to share. So then explain why its done, not how. Or hell just link it up to where you learned.

[dinos22]

lol you're not a patient type are ya hahahah


wazza has been discussed to death and back at XS

you really should just do a quick search there and find plenty of material to read up

essentially you want to make your HDDs work hard for a little while and then do the bench basically
most ppl just copy a file from one partition to another and thats that

wazza has lost a lot of its charm with high L2 cache CPUs as gains are very small now though but yeah thats that :)

[3oh6]

Dino is right, copy wazza doesn't have near the effect on i7 as it use to due to the massive cache on these chips. my understanding of wazza has always been that it is a process which ends up clearing the CPU cache - or 'aligning it' - letting SPi room to run free thus increasing the calculating speed. with the cavernous cache of i7, this just isn't as effective.

most setups from what i have seen on i7 only gain 3-4 seconds for 32M from wazza. with that said, i haven't really sat down and tried to optimize my wazza method for i7. i am still running my basic setup from the first E6300 C2D's i had. i know, i know, shame on me :thumbdown:

[dinos22]

most setups from what i have seen on i7 only gain 3-4 seconds for 32M from wazza.
i am thinking that it may be even less than that but i am probably not doing it well enough either heh

[<<HANNIBAL>>]

Just type this in RUN: fsutil file createnew D:\wazaaa.dat 1941504000
it will create a file in your partition D:
then copy the file in the SPI folder and after that run SPI 32m

[Chuchnit]

lol you're not a patient type are ya hahahah


wazza has been discussed to death and back at XS

you really should just do a quick search there and find plenty of material to read up

essentially you want to make your HDDs work hard for a little while and then do the bench basically
most ppl just copy a file from one partition to another and thats that

wazza has lost a lot of its charm with high L2 cache CPUs as gains are very small now though but yeah thats that :)

I'm not impatient Dinos. I made that remark becuase I know waza method is closely gaurded by some. Yes I have a link to an xs thread in my favs, but it's over 100 pages to go through. Not to sound lazy, because every tweak I know has included countless hours scouring xs and i4memory ;) for the info. I just don't have time with a newborn and all to read up on it. Super Pi has kinda grown on me and I figured I'd try learning it a little.

Dino is right, copy wazza doesn't have near the effect on i7 as it use to due to the massive cache on these chips. my understanding of wazza has always been that it is a process which ends up clearing the CPU cache - or 'aligning it' - letting SPi room to run free thus increasing the calculating speed. with the cavernous cache of i7, this just isn't as effective.

most setups from what i have seen on i7 only gain 3-4 seconds for 32M from wazza. with that said, i haven't really sat down and tried to optimize my wazza method for i7. i am still running my basic setup from the first E6300 C2D's i had. i know, i know, shame on me :thumbdown:

Sweet Jody!! Thats really what I was looking for. Just the general jist in laymen terms.

i am thinking that it may be even less than that but i am probably not doing it well enough either heh

It all good. You make up for it in raw horsepower ;)

Just type this in RUN: fsutil file createnew D:\wazaaa.dat 1941504000
it will create a file in your partition D:
then copy the file in the SPI folder and after that run SPI 32m


Thank you very much HANNIBAL :)

[DrNip]

Good to know as I tried it on my i7 and didn't see the gains others reported. I was startin to think I was doin somethin wrong.

[3oh6]

I'm not impatient Dinos.
i think he said that because you bumped the thread after 3 hours because no one replied yet :)

Sweet Jody!! Thats really what I was looking for. Just the general jist in laymen terms.
no problem, but don't quote me on the actual reason for why it works, that is just my understanding...keeping in mind i never really cared why, just how to make it work best :D

[Chuchnit]

i think he said that because you bumped the thread after 3 hours because no one replied yet :)


no problem, but don't quote me on the actual reason for why it works, that is just my understanding...keeping in mind i never really cared why, just how to make it work best :D

I inderstand. I just saw the views and figured no one wanted to share.

I guess I'm wierd. I kinda like to think I understand what Tweak i use is doing behind the scenes. It gives the the illusion that I know what I'm doing. Not that it really matters but it makes me feel better. Honestly i asked though because i started a guide here (thats sucks) and can't explain some of the tweaks I've heard of or even use. I really need to make the time to do that stupid thing and finish it :(

[karmakazi]

Try and experiement with different maxmem settings too 512, 600,640, 670... also play with the waza file size in spi tweaker. 1024k and 512k are my favs. And remember higher available memory doesnt necessarily mean better waza, but it can indicate that (verify with final scores). Sometimes the "CDT" or "IV" options have helped my times so try those too. Most of pi tweaking is system subjective so you will have to experiment with values, until you find what your OS/bios/etc likes. Just my $.02

[Chuchnit]

Thanks karmakazi! When this comp is over I plan on playing lots of 32m. I really wanna learn the ins and outs of this bench.

[G H Z]

my understanding of wazza has always been that it is a process which ends up clearing the CPU cache - or 'aligning it' - letting SPi room to run free thus increasing the calculating speed.

It's actually the System Cache ;)

From TechNet:

Windows allocates a portion of the virtual memory in your system to the file system cache. The file system cache is a subset of the memory system that retains recently used information for quick access. The size of the cache depends on the amount of physical memory installed and the memory required for applications. The operating system dynamically adjusts the size of the cache as needed, sharing memory optimally between process working sets and the system cache.

And why Wazza is effective:

Frequent cache flushing might occur if data is written to the disk frequently in order to free pages

If your running on XP/2003, open Task Manager and you can watch it grow during CW file copy.

[Chuchnit]

It's actually the System Cache ;)

From TechNet:

Windows allocates a portion of the virtual memory in your system to the file system cache. The file system cache is a subset of the memory system that retains recently used information for quick access. The size of the cache depends on the amount of physical memory installed and the memory required for applications. The operating system dynamically adjusts the size of the cache as needed, sharing memory optimally between process working sets and the system cache.

And why Wazza is effective:

Frequent cache flushing might occur if data is written to the disk frequently in order to free pages

If your running on XP/2003, open Task Manager and you can watch it grow during CW file copy.

Thank you so much GHZ. I like learning my own style to tweaks, but I'm one of those wierdos who like to understand WHY I'm doing what I am. Now I can visualize what wazza is doing when I'm using it.

[Chuchnit]

The Many OS software tweaks of SuperPi Exposed
Submitted by Johnny Bravo on Sat, 04/05/2008 - 01:26. Guides
Over the years there has always been various tweaks touted and spread over overclocking forums on how to improve benchmark results. One area this has been quite prevalent in is SuperPi. We see one guy try something different, get a faster time and suddenly everyone's trying it for themselves. Too often we simply try the newest thing with no real understanding of what it is doing and how it is supposed to help our times. Then when we don't see any real gains we are left wondering what all the fuss is about or why it works for some people and not us.

What I propose here is a thread in which we can all input our findings to test these various tweaks. Each week we shall choose one tweak - specify a platform and run various SuperPi sizes (1M, 2M...) and hopefully through numbers we will establish what gains if any that tweak brings.

To begin with I ask for you to suggest any additional known software tweaks that are commonly used. I have made a list of the ones I know of so far but am welcome to suggestions as we go on.

Known tweaks

XP or 2003 Server
Copy Wazza
LargeSystemCache
/MAXMEM or /BURNMEMORY
GUI Theme
Processor Affinity and Priority
Background Services
RAMDISK Applications


Source (http://www.ocxtreme.org/main/?q=node/2&page=0%2C0&)

Interesting read....

[HITandRUN]

Source (http://www.ocxtreme.org/main/?q=node/2&page=0%2C0&)

Interesting read....

Yeah I have read that a while ago and picked out the best tweaks for me. I never tried the Waza thing though. :blink:

[Chuchnit]

I've only used spitweaker for waza, but only for a couple runs. I have taken about 30 seconds off by finding the right pagefile for that particualar install. Now I just need to find my "range" to test with each install to find the best quickly.

[HITandRUN]

I've only used spitweaker for waza, but only for a couple runs. I have taken about 30 seconds off by finding the right pagefile for that particualar install. Now I just need to find my "range" to test with each install to find the best quickly.

Got a DL linky to this by a chance? :blush:

[Chuchnit]

I will have to dig it up. I am on my phone right now. I had to dig a little to find a good d/l of version 1.6.

[HITandRUN]

I will have to dig it up. I am on my phone right now. I had to dig a little to find a good d/l of version 1.6.

Well I found it! Here (http://i4memory.com/f36/monteboys-super-pi-tweaker-released-7307/) is a link in case somebody needs it! :thumbsup:

[Kal-EL]

Cheers HnR :toast:

[HITandRUN]

Cheers HnR :toast:

:D :ola:

[Chuchnit]

Thanks! Have you tried it yet? I never could get a good copy from that link. I had to find it somewhere else.

[karmakazi]

If you want to do a copy waza manually, here is how I used to do it. I would use fsutil to create multiple 100mb files (however many I needed to get to my waza size). Then I would use WinRAR to RAR the files then I would copy/paste that RAR'd file from superpi drive (C:\) -> D:\ -> C:\.